Transcript of interview with Dr. Horace R. Hicks, conducted September 14, 1982 by Akida T. Mensah.
This is a tape interview with Dr. Horace R. Hicks of 605 W. Nine Mile Road. Dr. Hicks lived for a while in the Church Hill area at 23rd and Leigh andhas agreed to share his remembrances of the CCA Ball Park and the people who played a major part in organizing athletics in the Church Hill area. This interview is being conducted by Akida T. Mensah on September 14, 1982. Furthermore, the interview is being conducted in the office of Dr. Hicks.
I - Dr. Hicks, where were you born?
N - Born in Richmond, Virginia.
I - And when was this?
N - November 17, 1903.
I - And who were your parents?
N - My father's name was Roe Pug Hicks; my mother's name was Irene Moore Tinsel.
I - And where did you live sir?
N - I lived at 512 N. 23rd Street.
I - About how long did you live there?
N - Oh, maybe 10 years.
I - What schools did you attend?
N - Attended the old Bellevue School over on Broad Street. I started grade school; my teacher was Mrs. Snider, Mrs. Snider taught us 1st, 2nd and 3rd grades.
I - Do you remember the principal that was there at the time?
N - Ernest Showning.
I - Were many of the teachers or the principal residents of Church Hill.
N -Most all of them lived on Church Hill. From there I went over to the Bellevue Junior School, that was old Mrs. VanLew, who was a northern spy. She was supposed to have had a tunnel leading to the James River in order to get rid of a lot of prisoners of the Confederacy. From there I went to John Marshall High School which then was located up on Marshall Street next to the John Marshall Home. Home of the Supreme Court Justice. From there I went to William and Mary in 1920, graduated W&M in 1924 from there I went to the Medical College of Virginia and graduated in Medicine in 1928
I - And then you set up practice?
N - Then I went to West Virginia and stayed in West Virginia for 5 years and I came back to Virginia and located here in Highland Springs. I was a professional baseball player, I played baseball on the old Mayo Island with the Richmond Colts, I was a shortstop. I played four years while I was going to the MCV. I coached basketball and baseball at the MCV in 1924 - 1928. I coached Benedictine High School basketball in 1928. I have been the senior PGA Champion of Virginia twice, 1952 & 1954.
I - Very good. How did you get started in your athletic career?
N - My father was a professional baseball manager and player.
I - What team did he play for?
N - Well he played for Greensboro, N.C. and he also played for the Richmond,the ball club in Richmond, He played with Lynchburg back in the Federal League. So it was quite natural that I become a baseball fan.
I - In our telephone conversation we talked about the old CCA ball park and your association with that, could you . . . ?
N - Well I think, to go back a little bit, on 22nd and Venable Street was located Christ church Episcopal Church. It had a minister by the name of Dr. Eagle. Dr. Eagle was quite an athlete and he played baseball along with the Church Hill boys. And he also had a gymnasium in the basement of that church where they had horses and setting up exercises where the pulleys were the weights, basketball court. And he kept the gym quite busy with the boys in the neighborhood. Now from that church they started with Dr. William H. Parker whose name is on Parker Field over in Richmond. Dr. Parker was quite a sportsman himself, he was a general practioner of medicine and a loveable person.
I - Was he from Church Hill, Dr. Parker?
N -Yes, he had an office at 23rd and Broad Street on Church Hill.
I -To your knowledge did he also live in Church Hill?
N - Yes, he lived at 23rd and Broad Street. He owned and operated the CHAC which was the Church Hill Athletic Club. And it played on that field over there in Fairmont which at that time had no fence or no clubhouse, but Dr. Parker was instrumental in raising enough money to build a club house and put a fence around that park.
I - Did you participate in the building of the fence?
N - I had nothing to do with that, I was a baseball player. I worked with Dr. Parker after I graduated in medicine for about a year. He was a very loveable man and he deserved to have his name put on the Parker Field out there. Going back a little farther, when I was a young boy on Church Hill just before I was born, Jefferson Avenue was a gulley, about 10 - 12 feet deep. Of course they filled it up and they put the street car down Jefferson Avenue. Old man Greene and his two sons run a woodyard at 23rd and Jefferson. Probably most people wont know that, but old timers will. Mr. Perrin operated a delicatessen and little store, right there at 23rd and Jefferson. Mr. Perrin lived right across the street on the same side. I remember Mr. Cutie, lived over there, Mr. Backalery lived there on Church Hill next to me. My parents moved from 512 N. 23rd Street to 2312 Venable Street. I was probably 14 or 15 years old.
I - Do you remember the Earlys, where the House of Happiness is?
N- Right there as I recall was a boy's club in that very building. Most of the boys around Church Hill attended that place over there. I don't remember the name of the operator, I've forgotten him. But I do remember a Mr. Towser who came to Richmond from North Carolina, a single man about 40 years old about 5'6" tall and had a limp in one leg. I imagine he had polio when he was young. He got all the boys in the neighborhood up until they were 16 years old, anywhere from 5 - 16. And he had them all competing against one another. They would run 25-yard or 50-yard dash, broad jump, high jump, played basketball, how many basketballs you could make and he gave prizes. He would go around town and collect the money from individuals thru donated money so he could make prizes and the prize consisted of medals. First prize was a gold medal; 2nd was silver; 3rd was a bronze.Many, many boys won those medals during his time over there. Mr. Towser lived on that field in a tent.
I - Before you started talking about that I asking, there was a George Howard of course he lived many years ago, back in 1870's who built a home that Mrs. Scott talks about in her book, Old Richmond Neighborhoods, and he had a daughter who married Mr. Early and they sold yeast cakes from that residence and I was just wondering if you remembered it being there. I think they tore the house down in 1923 or 1930. But it was supposed to have been right there where the house of happiness is now on Venable.
N - As I recall, that House of Happiness was a boy's club. I think one of the funniest of all the things that impressed me when I was a young boy was when ever they had a funeral they would start from the home where ever the individual died and they would come up Jefferson Avenue and they would have a band, and they were a-hollering and a-screaming and going to the cemetery. And we boys used to enjoy very much.
I - What cemetery would they be going?
N- I think they was going out towards Oakwood. But we used to sit around and laugh like its nobody business. And they had the casket sitting on an open truck, drawn by two horses. The other thing that I remember coming down Jefferson avenue was these farmers out of Hanover. They had a two wheel vehicle and a white canvass top over it and a mule drawing it. And the farmer would have his produce inside that camper; and he'd lay back there and go to sleep and there were 7 - 8 of them lined up coming down Jefferson Ave. away from Hanover going to market down on 17th Street. Those farmers could go to sleep at home and those mules were so educated that they could drag that cart all the way cross Richmond down to the market and pull up in the same identical spot every time. When a man would wake up . . . . We boys had a lot of fun with them. We'd catch one that was sleep and sometines they would bring right good watermelons. So we called it rolling the watermelons, so we would jump up on the back and roll a watermelon out of that truck. Take overthere and break it up and eat it.
I - So in your early life the Dr. Parker, and Mr. Towser somewhat in addition to your father's influence, influenced your athletic interest.
N - That's right. I've got a picture of John Marshall High School in 1920. We were the state champions.
I - This was in baseball?
N - No, basketball.
I - The time will arrive and hopefully very soon that we would want to take some pictures of some of these scenes and when we get it together we would like to maybe get a copy of that picture and if you have others.
N - I a lot of pictures in my home. Baseball teams and basketball teams that I have played on.
I - We have talked some about your early childhood and your involvement in athletics and some of the people who influenced you as far as athletics is concerned. Could you give us the name of some of the players on some of the teams.
N - Yes, on the original Church Hill athletic clubs teams: Billy Hay was the catcher and Bill Worton was the first baseman, Tuggy Stuart was a second baseman, I played shortstop. Outfield was Harry Carter, Buck Chewning, Claude Woodard, was therefore the mayor of Richmond. Pitching we had Joe Bowling, who was back from Washington in the big league, ox Marshallwho came here from W&M, Kurt Thompson who came here from Lynchburg College.
I - Did we name the 3rd baseman?
N - Charlie Whitmore, played 3rd base. So this was one of the first teams and Dr. Parker of course was the on line operator. Bingo Evans was themanager of that first ball club.
I - Did Bingo Evans live in Church Hill?
N - All these people lived on Church Hill at that time.
I - Dr. Parker has got quite a bit of recognition thru the Parker Field being named in his honor, do you know whether there are relatives of his still alive or whether they would be...?
N - They all gone I think. Dr. Parker had one son. Willard, where Willard is, I have no idea.
I - Would you have a picture of Dr. Parker or..?
N - I have a picture, yes.
I - That I am sure will be of great interest to people we are trying to reach. Is there anything else you can remember about Dr. Parker, you know his character or . . . ?
N - Dr. Parker was not only a general practitioner of medicine but he was a company doctor for Lucky Strike.
I - You were telling me about your golf trophies and I would like to hear morea bout it?
N - I don't want to be bragging. I didn't play in any golf tournaments unti lafter I was through playing professional baseball. I've been the senior champion out at Hermitage Country Club, played in the final out there Championship of the Country Club of VA and Hermitage Country Club all in the same year. I got defeated in both of them. I won the PGA Championship in Stanton in 1952. I won that up in the valley at the old hotel up there. Hot Springs.
I -You have quite an interesting array of trophies up there.
N - This one middle trophy up there was a doctor's tournament and they put that trophy out and they said that in order to keep it you had to win three straight years in a row. And I won it three straight years in a row and kept it.
I -What about your family?
N - I have been married twice. My first wife died and I have one son by that marriage and he is 50 years old.
I -W as he interested in athletics?
N - Yes, he played baseball, golf. Yankees took him to training one year, then they farmed him out to a team down in N.C. Then he got disgusted with it and quit and wouldn't play no more. I been married a second time, I married a girl who is 30 years younger than I am. She is a graduate nurse from Grace Hospital in Richmond and we have five children by that marriage The oldest one is just finished Hampden Sydney College. He's selling insurance down in Norfolk, the girl is 23, she just finished Sweet Briar, and I still have one son 17; he participated in football over at Patrick Henry High School in Hanover County.
I - What position does he play?
N - He plays on the kick-off team.
I - Was your second wife from Richmond?
N - Naw, my second wife, Caroline, is from Craigsville, Virgina that's up on the other side of Staunton.
I - So your practice here, do you get to see or did you get to see many of the people that you knew in Church Hill ... ?
N - Oh yea, sure, of course. I delivered over 2500 babies in my lifetime as a doctor.
I - Did you find, you set up practice here and in Highland Springs which isn't that far from Church Hill when you think of how much people move around, did you find many of the people that you knew in Church Hill moving to this area or ... ?
N - Yes indeed. Most of the people in this area down here now came from Church Hill and they worked over in Richmond in the tobacco factory, in other words, this community down here is dependent upon the tobacco industry over there for their livelihood. If anything happened to the tobacco factories over there, this place would go dead real quick.
I - I can remember the L. M. Gunn had a used car lot down on Nine Mile Road and I think they finally moved down here. A couple of years ago I think I met the son of the original owner.
N - You know back in the old days we used to say any man as soon as he got a good position and made a little money he automatically moved out on Monument Avenue or out on the Boulevard. And that took care of most of guys that were born on Church Hill by moving out. Then when desegration came along every white person that could get out of Church Hill moved. And that left all there was that didn't have enough money to move.
I - I wanted to ask you a question, you mentioned those funerals going down Jefferson Avenue, I've talked to black families who talked about coming down were these blacks, because I have talked.
N - I used to go down on Government Road on Sunday morning and the preachers, the colored preachers were having the colored women all dressed in white and they were baptising them. They would take them out in Gillies Creek down there, and the preacher would get a dozen and bring them up. And I remember seeing them screaming and a hollering. We boys thought that was the funniest thing we ever saw.
I - It seems that was a pretty popular area for that kind of thing. In your growing up in Church Hill was there any significant contact with blacks.
N -We always figured that were spots, the blacks lived in certain. In other ords in Carrington Street right off Venable Street that was almost all colored thru there in the old days. And we used to rock battle. The white boys stand up on the corner where Springer Drug Co. was and throw rocks down to Carrington Street and they throw rocks back up at this ways.
I - I was reading Virginia Dabney's book. It seemed rock battles was the thing in Richmond for many years. There was a group that lived in Jefferson Park area that used to battle the group from down around 17th Street or n that area and in talking to the older people, what you are saying is typical.
N Nobody ever got hurt. They were eager to see who could holler the loudest and back up. I want to tell you one other thing. Over at St. John's Church the preacher was named Hugh Sublett; Dr. Sublett lived in Fairmont and Dr. Sublett would ride his bicycle every morning between 8 - 9 o'clock down 23rd Street and peddle up to Broad Street going to his church. And every afternoon along bout 4 - 5 - 6 - o'clock, Dr. Sublett would be riding back home on that bicycle.
I -And you say he was the pastor at St. John?
N -Yea, Dr. Hugh Sublett.
I -So a great many of the people during your childhood and growing up lived right in the Church Hill Community.
N - Oh sure. Like I said they all lived over there. Church Hill was the original part of Richmond. As people got wealthy and got a little bit of [Transcript ends here.]
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